dalnet-services@ observations
Kobi: Thanks for the reply to the post. I replied, and thought it went to the mailing list. Everyone: I started playing with NS/CS access one day and found some peculiarities. Kobi and DALnet now know of them, and I am pleased. Hopefully the bugs I pointed out will be fixed for the next services release. I posted to the helpers@ mailing list yesterday, and I found that the initial to welcome message from dalnet hasn't been updated since 1996. At the beginning of the email, it says to post to the helpers list, to mail to Helpers@lists.dal.net -- Well, you will get the email sent back; only helpers@lists.dal.net (lowercase h) works. I am not sure if dalnet-services@ is the same way, but the same syntax is there... Welcome to the DALnet-services@lists.dal.net mailing list! Anyway, I hope we can generate more threads here. I believe there is a lot to discuss (to make services better). Myself, I'd like to see HelpServ completely overhauled. The information within is way too obsolete... Maybe I will start a thread next about it. Stay tuned. ;) As for the rest of you, start posting some threads on the general mailing lists. We are here to make DALnet better; to discuss possible improvements. PapaSmurf
On Wed, Dec 30, 2009 at 1:01 PM, PapaSmurf <freedried@yahoo.com> wrote:
Kobi: Thanks for the reply to the post. I replied, and thought it went to the mailing list.
Everyone: I started playing with NS/CS access one day and found some peculiarities. Kobi and DALnet now know of them, and I am pleased. Hopefully the bugs I pointed out will be fixed for the next services release.
I posted to the helpers@ mailing list yesterday, and I found that the initial to welcome message from dalnet hasn't been updated since 1996. At the beginning of the email, it says to post to the helpers list, to mail to Helpers@lists.dal.net -- Well, you will get the email sent back; only helpers@lists.dal.net (lowercase h) works.
I am not sure if dalnet-services@ is the same way, but the same syntax is there...
Welcome to the DALnet-services@lists.dal.net mailing list!
Anyway, I hope we can generate more threads here. I believe there is a lot to discuss (to make services better).
Myself, I'd like to see HelpServ completely overhauled. The information within is way too obsolete... Maybe I will start a thread next about it. Stay tuned. ;)
As for the rest of you, start posting some threads on the general mailing lists. We are here to make DALnet better; to discuss possible improvements.
PapaSmurf
If your emails are being bounced due case sensitivity with the list address, then there are deeper issues looming than the welcome message being sent. While RFC 2821 does state that the local part of an email address (e.g. the username portion), almost no email provider or ISP follows this, since it creates a lot of confusion and interoperability issues. Rather than change the welcome message (which is actually correct, in that it is using the list name as configured in MailMan (https://lists.dal.net/mailman/listinfo)), a better solution would be to "fix" the current implementation so it handles this gracefully. Now, granted I haven't been active on the network for quite sometime (but do still occasionally follow these lists), so things may have changed a lot, but HelpServ was originally an ircII help service, containing the help files for the ircII client (which were normally a separate package from the client itself). While not all the information it contains is obsolete, it is likely to be of little use to users of other clients (which is the majority of most of IRC users today, heh). -SecretAgent
.n. Sorry for the double post (hit send too 'fast' :-/ ) On Wed, Dec 30, 2009 at 6:30 PM, Jason Hill <secrtagnt@gmail.com> wrote:
If your emails are being bounced due case sensitivity with the list address, then there are deeper issues looming than the welcome message being sent. While RFC 2821 does state that the local part of an email address (e.g. the username portion), almost no email provider or ISP follows this, since it creates a lot of confusion and interoperability issues.
Should read as (so it makes sense): If your emails are being bounced due case sensitivity with the list address, then there are deeper issues looming than the welcome message being sent. While RFC 2821 does state that the local part of an email address (e.g. the username portion) is case sensitive, almost no email provider or ISP follows this, since it creates a lot of confusion and interoperability issues. -SecretAgent
On Wed, 30 Dec 2009, Jason Hill wrote:
Should read as (so it makes sense):
If your emails are being bounced due case sensitivity with the list address, then there are deeper issues looming than the welcome message being sent. While RFC 2821 does state that the local part of an email address (e.g. the username portion) is case sensitive, almost no email provider or ISP follows this, since it creates a lot of confusion and interoperability issues.
Apparently the only ISP's and email providers you use run windows :P Pretty much every unix MTA I've come across uses case sensitive usernames. Well the LDA does anyways. Jason
On Thu, Dec 31, 2009 at 5:23 PM, Jason Slagle <raistlin@tacorp.net> wrote:
On Wed, 30 Dec 2009, Jason Hill wrote: [snip] Apparently the only ISP's and email providers you use run windows :P Pretty much every unix MTA I've come across uses case sensitive usernames. Well the LDA does anyways.
You mean case-Insensitive, right? In current versions of Sendmail, Sendmail 8: sending e-mail to "BlaHBlaH" will reach the same destination as sending to blahblah. The E-MAIL ADDRESS is case-insensitive with respect to delivery. The LOCAL USERNAME must is case-sensitive, and must be all lowercase. Of course the case of characters in e-mail message headers are preserved, but they have nothing to do with delivery. Only the envelope recipient is important, and that's case-insensitive. That is: no matter what case of characters you type in the e-mail address that you SEND to the MTA, sendmail always converts it to lowercase. The e-mail goes to the username that is the same as the e-mail address, but all lowercase. This is true, unless you are one of those very unusual sites that do something like MODIFY_MAILER_FLAGS(`LOCAL', `+u')dnl *(In fact, if you create a unix user with an uppercase character in their username, they won't be able to receive mail at all until/unless you create an /etc/aliases entry to map username: User) Postfix and a few others do pretty much the same thing, differing in some fine details (but the SMTP rcpt to: is case-insensitive nonetheless)...
Jason
-- -J
Please, can we keep on topic? I don't want to re-moderate the list. --je On Fri, Jan 1, 2010 at 12:20 AM, James Hess <mysidia@gmail.com> wrote:
On Thu, Dec 31, 2009 at 5:23 PM, Jason Slagle <raistlin@tacorp.net> wrote:
On Wed, 30 Dec 2009, Jason Hill wrote: [snip] Apparently the only ISP's and email providers you use run windows :P Pretty much every unix MTA I've come across uses case sensitive usernames. Well the LDA does anyways.
You mean case-Insensitive, right? In current versions of Sendmail, Sendmail 8: sending e-mail to "BlaHBlaH" will reach the same destination as sending to blahblah.
The E-MAIL ADDRESS is case-insensitive with respect to delivery. The LOCAL USERNAME must is case-sensitive, and must be all lowercase.
Of course the case of characters in e-mail message headers are preserved, but they have nothing to do with delivery. Only the envelope recipient is important, and that's case-insensitive.
That is: no matter what case of characters you type in the e-mail address that you SEND to the MTA, sendmail always converts it to lowercase. The e-mail goes to the username that is the same as the e-mail address, but all lowercase.
This is true, unless you are one of those very unusual sites that do something like MODIFY_MAILER_FLAGS(`LOCAL', `+u')dnl
*(In fact, if you create a unix user with an uppercase character in their username, they won't be able to receive mail at all until/unless you create an /etc/aliases entry to map username: User)
Postfix and a few others do pretty much the same thing, differing in some fine details (but the SMTP rcpt to: is case-insensitive nonetheless)...
Jason
-- -J _______________________________________________ DALnet-services mailing list DALnet-services@lists.dal.net https://lists.dal.net/mailman/listinfo/dalnet-services
participants (5)
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James Hess -
Jason Hill -
Jason Slagle -
Joe -
PapaSmurf